Hundreds of users, either anonymous or members of wikiHow start How-to articles daily. But unfortunately many of them are tagged as stub or need further editing to become a quality how-to article. Why not guide the users to create quality How-to manuals, which are complete at their own and do not need any further editing. Can’t we provide the users with a link to Writer’s guide whenever they start a new topic on wikiHow. This can be made mandatory for the users starting their first article and rest should just be provided a link, and can take guidance from their if they need. This would also help wikiHow to reach its mission - to create the world’s most helpful how-to guides and would also lower the numbers in editing or cleanup apps.
system
2
+1 Especially now since articles don’t get viewed AND cuz of the review team
I think he means if we include it into the welcoming message @LoisWade42
Ofcourse we do, Loiswade. I think you did’nt get me. I was suggesting to give a link for Writer’s guide ’ whenever they start a new topic on wikiHow’. Some of the users ignore the bot messages and many go through the wikiHow tour, I feel. If given the link when they start, they would prefer reading first. And in the wikiHow tour, the link to Writer’s Guide is not eye-catching. With a huge bunch of links, it is common that a user won’t go through every given link.
OoT2D
6
^ 50% agree. For me, I never took the tour. It wouldn’t open on my iPhone browser.
Yes, we need an expansion of the WelcomeBot message.
Yeah- maybe we should rename the topic as so. @Darkfrost
system
9
While I understand the urge to “throw it all in there so all the new users know what to do”? Actual new user behavior on the site seems to contraindicate that course of action. We used to include a LOT more information in the welcome messages… but since we pared it down to just the tour link, we’ve had better response ratios from newbies, and converted a higher percentage of new users into editors. More people edit after the smaller welcome message than after the previous “everything but the kitchen sink” messages we used to post. I’m guessing it’s because the longer messages with more links and information tended to overwhelm new editors. Additionally, with the present system, the newbies get welcomed by long term, trusted users, who can then give them the links personally and tailor their introductory links to the user’s specific needs and interests. More personal this way… and less overwhelming.
Agreed. And to reinforce this point, take a look at this welcome message I got on Wikipedia: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User\_talk:96.55.196.13
. I have experience in editing Wikipedia, but imagine how a person completely new to wikis would feel about seeing this. Not to compare wikiHow with Wikipedia, but our community is much smaller than theirs, so hitting new editors with a ton of links would most definitely overwhelm them.
OoT2D
11
@Illneedasaviour
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/User\_talk:OoT2D#Welcome
Not talking about the Welcome Message, which is pretty right and ofcourse, too much coaching can frustate a new user. The discussion is for including Writer’s guide in the WRITE AN ARTICLE section and NOT in the WELCOME MESSAGES. @Loiswade
, @Hannah-Banana-xox
, @Darkfrost
SarahB
13
I agree that too many links to various pages could be overwhelming to new editors, and I am not convinced that all new editors take the wiki tour or look at the Writer’s Guide in welcome message on the basis that if they had looked at the links there would not be so many articles with tags for deletion, cleanup etc…Is it worth considering putting a short message saying…Before publishing this article have you read wikiHows policies and writers guide? SarahB
In my experience, all articles require further editing and I think that’s ok. In fact, that’s what a wiki is all about – working together to improve the content and making bold edits. It would be nice if more editors read the writer’s guide, but I don’t know if we can make it mandatory. Many people come here determined to write an article and don’t brother to learn about the guidelines first. Therefore, I don’t think they will read the writer’s guide even if there’s a link for it. To me, it’s similar to End User License agreements and software – anyone who really wants to download the software is going to just scroll through and click “I Agree” without bothering to find out what it is they are actually agreeing to. Rather than focus on making people read the writer’s guide, I think it may be more productive to think of ways to make editing stub articles easier and quicker.
@Elonica
, You are right on your part. But don’t you think SOME of the users would refer to Writer’s guide once before they start their topic on wikiHow? A new user receives a welome message within hours, and at a sudden moment noone bothers to take the tour, but when they will try to start a new topic, it might be possibly that they would have a look at the guide. What do you feel?
@SarahB
. It’s a good idea to give a message before publishing, but a new user will be frustated if he/she has’nt written according to the assigned guidelines, and moreover he would continue with publishing rather than rewriting the whole article. I feel it would be better if we give the same message at the starting, in another dialog box.
system
18
Here are some observations I’ve made through the years: *Unless we commit to keeping the welcome message simple, it tends to “bloat” into a library of information that’s at best, ignored and at worst, turns people away because it’s overwhelming. I think sometimes we assume that if we provide information, people will actually read it. In practice, this is rarely true! *The kind of people who want to read the rules and policies before they contribute never have trouble finding those rules and policies. They either find them by looking around or by asking. *The kind of people who like to dive in and learn by doing (most people!) don’t read any policies you send to them, because they want to dive in and learn by doing. *Our best asset for educating people is to see what people do, offer them gentle feedback…wash, rinse, repeat. The personal touch is what makes this community great, and if you ask people who have been here for years what made them decide to stick around, it was someone reaching out and offering friendly encouragement and feedback.
I agree with Krystle on this, and I have observed the same things during my time here. For me, Recent Changes and Revision History were the best teaching tools. I learned how to improve my writing by seeing the changes other people were making, but that comes with time. So, it’s important to be patient with people and provide coaching when relevant. Reading the writer’s guide doesn’t automatically make someone a better writer. Improving writing takes time and since wikiHow is a volunteer site, sometimes we have to work with people and be patient as they learn. Just because someone is writing stubs now doesn’t mean they will be writing the same way in the future. No piece of writing starts out perfect and everyone has a different idea of what constitutes good writing. Stubs give people something to work with at least. Sometimes, I have been able to get a sense of what an article wants to be or can be in a way that I wouldn’t if I was just told to write something from scratch. When I began editing other people’s work, it reminded me of a sculptor who said he got his ideas from looking at the marble and seeing what it wanted to be. I guess that’s how I feel about the wiki editing process. I think that the continual editing process is what makes wikis special, and that it allows content to become really great over time. It’s a trade-off though and sometimes you have to be patient with things like stub articles.
